318. How Writing Can Be Part of Your Healing Journey with Francesca Lia Block

Author and educator Francesca Lia Block discusses how writing can be healing, the ways to channel the past into story, and why that means you should pursue your creative ideas.

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https://francescaliablock.com/books

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Transcript

Jennia: Hello, I'm Jennia D'Lima. Welcome to Writing and Editing, the author-focused podcast that takes a whole-person approach to everything related to both writing and editing. Francesca Lia Block is the author of over 40 books, including her latest, House of Hearts, and the winner of multiple awards. And she's here to explain how writing can be part of your healing journey.

Jennia: Thank you so much for being on the show!

Francesca Lia Block: Thank you so much for having me! It's a pleasure.

Jennia: Have you always intuitively known that writing can be healing, or was this something that you discovered over time? Or maybe put into words later on?

Francesca Lia Block: Yes, I think I put it into words later, but it was something I discovered very young. Because I was writing poetry as early as I can remember, and looking back on it now, I definitely see the relationship between writing those poems and some kind of catharsis or healing.

Jennia: Yeah. I think it can be easier for people to see that with poetry because it is so emotionally charged and it's so much a part of ourselves. And I think maybe we think of our characters as being distanced from us, or I'm not writing about myself. So can you explain how it also comes out when you're writing a character?

Francesca Lia Block: Yes. So I consider characters as different parts of myself. Kind of like in Jungian psychology where they say in your dream, all the characters in the dream are the dreamer. So in the same way, all the characters in my books are some part of me—

Jennia: Mmm.

Francesca Lia Block: —and that's a way to stay connected to them and understand them better. And they often work out issues that I'm going through in my personal life.

Jennia: Is that something that you consciously include in your outline and your plotting? Or, again, is that something that just sort of occurs?

Francesca Lia Block: I would say it's a natural thing that happens. A lot of times, I don't know why, I am drawn to a particular character or story and I have to write through and then rewrite and become more conscious of the plot. And then in the very end really figure out what the theme is that my unconscious mind was trying to tell me through this vision of the character or this connection to a particular story.

Jennia: Mmm, interesting. I do love that. I wonder if you could give an example from something you've written where that has occurred?

Francesca Lia Block: Yeah, so with House of Hearts, my latest book that just came out in paperback, I was drawn to a particular myth. And I also had a vision of a character; a woman sort of stalking through this desert landscape to avenge the death of a character from another book that I had written. So I didn't know where she came from. She just came out of my unconscious mind. And then she became the character in House of Hearts, unrelated to the previous book, which is called Beyond the Pale Motel. And then I took the myth that I'd been drawn to and this character who kind of rose up out of the darkness of the desert and put those things together, and then realized after writing House of Hearts, what that story meant to me, what that character meant to me. But I did not know that in the beginning. I was just drawn to it. And this is something I talk to my students about. They'll have a particular image that they're drawn to—or symbol or vision. They may not know why, but I tell them to explore it, go deep into it, and then later go back and figure out what it means, and then instill that into the work in a more overt way. But it starts with that initial unconscious image or idea or feeling or symbol.

Jennia: Have you ever gone back and looked at any of your previous work and been able to pick out maybe something you were going through at the time based on what you were writing, and then also to help you see how you evolved as a person after writing that?

Francesca Lia Block: Yes! There was a book I wrote as part of the Dangerous Angel series called Missing Angel Juan, and I didn't know at the time that I was—my father had just passed away and I just had a very painful breakup in my 20s. And I wrote this story. And later, through the help of my agent, actually, who looked at the first draft and said, I think this is about this, I realized that the idea was letting go of those who have left your life in some way. And that was the lesson I needed to learn from that.

Jennia: Yeah, it's amazing how sometimes that other person can pick up on something when we are the one actually going through it, and we completely miss it.

Francesca Lia Block: Yeah!

Jennia: But I wanted to ask, is there also a risk, though, of perhaps having a critique partner who misinterprets that and thinks you're going through something that you're actually not going through or dealing with?

Francesca Lia Block: That's a really interesting question. I feel as a teacher, I try to be very careful about imposing my ideas on the writer.

Jennia: Mhm.

Francesca Lia Block: So I'll come up with my idea or thesis about what they're dealing with. And then I test the waters to see if they agree with that or feel comfortable with that. And often it is correct, and it opens them up and it improves the project. But sometimes they're not quite ready for it, or perhaps I did misinterpret. So then I'll back away from that. But I think you just need to have a really intuitive person who's working with you in that way. And if you're not sure about that trust, kind of building it slowly to make sure that maybe even if they're wrong, that they'll be able to have a conversation with you and understand. And then you might be able to understand a little more about your work, even if they're not exactly on the nose with it.

Jennia: That's excellent advice! And I like that you brought up the whole trust and building trust, showing that it's not going to just spontaneously happen and that perhaps this is the type of relationship where you need to ease into it—

Francesca Lia Block: Yes.

Jennia: —and let those revelations come across too. Because they're going to have to have a firm grasp on you as a person in order to come to those kinds of conclusions anyway. But yes, I can see someone—especially when I thought about—going back to critique groups—when I was younger, and you'd read something and someone would say, "Oh, I love how you represented this," or, "I love how you were trying to get this across." And there were definitely times where I thought, "But I wasn't doing that at all. That's not what I meant" (laughs).

Francesca Lia Block: Yes, it can be very sensitive and—especially if you're in a group with a lot of people. So as a facilitator, I try to be really mindful of that. And also the critique group model is changing, where the writer used to be completely silenced—

Jennia: Mhm.

Francesca Lia Block: —during those. And now there's more interaction in a lot of groups. So I try to encourage that to a point where the writer can express that feeling if something is misinterpreted. So I just think it's an ongoing conversation and, as you say, really with people that you—that earn your trust over time.

Jennia: That's something else you've talked about. Not a critique group so much, but having a mentor. So can you explain how that plays a part in this?

Francesca Lia Block: Yes, I really believe in that. I was fortunate to have my father as someone who was very supportive of my writing from an early age. And not everyone has that. So I try to be that as much as possible for my students and give them that. I have had that from others in the past, too, from agents, editors, teachers. And it's very valuable and important. And it is a very intimate relationship that takes a lot of thought to really support that person in the best way for them at that particular time of their development.

Jennia: Yeah, well said. And also to ask you how honesty and vulnerability play a part in this process? And not just in the healing or working out past wounds, but each of the different players? So mentor and mentee, for instance.

Francesca Lia Block: So I think they're both extremely important. I would say that I am always honest, but also incredibly careful about how I express things and perhaps when I express them. Because the last thing I wanna do is interrupt that creative process. And after every lecture, I say to my students, anything that did not resonate for you, put it aside, forget about it, maybe keep notes and look at it later, but anything that interrupts that flow, I just want you to forget. Because that's my main goal, working with people, is just to make them feel empowered to express themselves creatively. Because all craft techniques can be taught later. But what can't be taught but can be killed is that creative impulse to express and to tell the story that's burning to be told. And then vulnerability, I very much believe that our stories come from that place. And as scary as it is, the best work comes from being really open and vulnerable. I will say I prefer fiction to nonfiction to write it. Because writing nonfiction, I've written a couple of memoirs. And putting it out there in that way is even more vulnerable—

Jennia: Mhm.

Francesca Lia Block: —and quite challenging, but very wonderful when people do it well—or when people attempted at all. Very brave. But yes. So you have to be vulnerable in both. And I think you have to protect yourself by having people around you who are supportive. Because putting yourself out in the world that way is scary. I think as a mentor, I also have to find the right way to express my own vulnerability, again, at the right time and in the right way. Sometimes it's not appropriate at all, and other times it really helps my students feel better about their own process. So it's always kind of judging based on the individual and the circumstances when to bring that in. But I do tend to lead with that.

Jennia: Yeah, it sounds like your method, too, helps a lot with that individual self doubt, since you aren't focusing on certain things over others, and that you are being very careful with how you express yourself to these students on an individual basis.

Francesca Lia Block: I mean, there's so much self doubt in all of us, and I certainly know that for myself in the creative process, and I recognize it in my students. So, yes, how to keep that at bay while you're getting that—especially that initial draft out and onto the page. And then having the people who help you shape it before it goes out into the world. So now I think you need community even more than ever. And I believe that's why so many of these writing programs have flourished during this time. Because people need to prepare their manuscripts in advance a little bit more, which can be a good thing. But also you don't want that process to stifle the creative flow, as I've said.

Jennia: Right, exactly. So even just thinking about the topic, I did think a lot about that. Well, it can feel like criticism even coming from your beta readers, your editor, whoever, and that that alone could feel like you need to then heal from that just so you can be creative again. Because you may feel almost as if your creativity is lacking in some way or it's not measuring up to some standard. So then how do you get over that?

Francesca Lia Block: I think it's, again, having either the person that you're working with, like the agent you choose, somebody who is sensitive to that, to the way they communicate that feedback, and/or finding ways to receive it that are not overly personalized, even though I know that's really hard. If you generally trust those people, I think you can remind yourself that they are doing it for your own well being. So I read somewhere that you should only take criticism from someone who has a vested interest in your success.

Jennia: Ahh!

Francesca Lia Block: So I think that's applicable (laughs).

Jennia: Yes! I do love that so much. And it also feels like trust is sort of the word of the episode—

Francesca Lia Block: Yes!

Jennia: —because it's just coming up again and again, but every time you say it I just think, yes, that makes so much sense! And I just, I really do love what you said because I think it [can] be so easy, especially if it's just some random person you've never even encountered. And then you read that two-star review, or the one-star review, or whatever it is and you just let that completely derail you and you start questioning everything. But you've never met this person. And like you said, they don't care if you succeed. This means nothing to them. It's just a review that they left and then they moved on with their life.

Francesca Lia Block: Exactly! Or even, to think in a more negative sense first, there sometimes is vested interest in not being supportive, frankly.

Jennia: Mmm.

Francesca Lia Block: You know? Which I hate to admit that, but we see that, right? So there is that as well. So you really have to surround yourself with support. And, you know, yes, we have to develop a thicker skin. It's something I have to work on every day and I don't do a great job at it (laughs), frankly, in my daily life. But it is an ongoing process to also strengthen yourself and to know that this is an important story that I need to tell. And this is the best I could do now. And, you know, I'm gonna keep growing and hopefully get stronger. I mean, for me, House of Hearts has sort of been the culmination of years of publishing and writing and reading and studying. I didn't get there at the beginning, but I would not have gotten where I am today without making a lot of mistakes and being very vulnerable and putting myself out in the world in a lot of different ways.

Jennia: Yes. Well, related to that, how do you think writing can foster a greater understanding of the self?

Francesca Lia Block: I think that it is always a kind of a search for self, at least for me. I know that House of Hearts is apparently a woman searching for her lost lover in the desert. It's really a search for herself, and her own identity, and her past, the truth about her past. And in the same way, writing the story was my own search for the current iteration of myself at that time. So I very much link those things together. And that's why, also, I love teaching, because I'm going on a journey with my student to help them hopefully figure out something about themselves in that way.

Jennia: How do you think some of this can extend to the reader when they're then going through that book, or that article, or whatever it is that you've created?

Francesca Lia Block: Well, I've been really fortunate in having people write to me through my career saying, "I read this story and it was really healing for me and it made me feel less alone," or understood, or just transported, and gave me this feeling of joy. So that is incredibly satisfying and I think is a byproduct of that deep search within and expressing it. And then using craft to shape it into a form that others can understand and can help them heal in certain ways, ideally.

Jennia: Mhm. It's one of those things, too, where we keep writing, but like you said, there are different iterations of the self. So there's always going to be something likely that we need to better understand, or maybe we need to understand this circumstance, or this relationship, or the state of the world, or whatever it is. So I think that just helps show that it's always going to be ongoing, both the creativity and that burgeoning self that never really comes to completion so much as an endpoint.

Francesca Lia Block: Yeah, exactly. And that's a beautiful thing that we can continue to grow in that way, I think.

Jennia: So are there some genres or forms of writing that better contribute to healing through writing? Or can it be any type of writing?

Francesca Lia Block: I mean, I do think memoir and creative nonfiction is sort of an immediate exploration of how to help other people survive different traumatic experiences, potentially. Poetry, as you said in the beginning, it's that immediate emotional hit that you sort of get. So that is great. But for me, it's often fiction, because telling a story in that way that is somewhat abstracted from my reality—

Jennia: Mhm.

Francesca Lia Block: —gives me a little more perspective on my personal experience. So I think all writing does it in some way, but I think for each person it might be different.

Jennia: I probably should have asked this question earlier, but can you explain the difference between healing and catharsis and how writing contributes to each of them?

Francesca Lia Block: Oh, that's a good question. I think telling the story itself can be cathartic.

Jennia: Mhm.

Francesca Lia Block: Getting it out and shaping it through craft kind of elevates it and heals. So the first step is the self-expression, but without the shaping and crafting, I think you don't get that same level of transcendent healing that can occur. And there's a great book called The Midnight Disease by Alice Flaherty. She is a neurologist, and she went and then turned this writing into this book about how the brain functions with creativity and how it is proven to heal. In fact, she talked about Holocaust survivors who found the two things that helped them were massage and storytelling, both of which take the experience and externalize it in some way.

Jennia: Yeah, wow!

Francesca Lia Block: I thought that was really powerful. So it brings that to mind. It's like getting it out of the body and then making it into something else to share with others.

Jennia: Oh, man, that's really fascinating. I've read something similar, too, about massage, but I didn't read that about writing. It was talking about healing from something traumatic and how moving the body helps get it out. I can't remember the exact science behind it, but it's something that has really stuck with me. So as soon as you said that, I had that little, like, "aha" moment.

Francesca Lia Block: Yes!

Jennia: Do you think there's ever a point, though, where someone, instead of healing from whatever it is, is instead of dwelling on it? Say, someone who writes something very similar over and over and over again, could that be a sign that maybe it's not having the function that they intended it to have?

Francesca Lia Block: I mean, there's two things here, I think writing the same themes or experiences again and again, perhaps in different ways, that is not uncommon among a lot of great writers, right? So we often see the repeated themes or the repeated stories, even, with slight variations. So I think that's fine because I think that's the person trying to process it in different ways and following their passions and obsessions, which I'm always encouraging everyone to follow. I think the trick is, this goes back to catharsis versus healing. Getting it out is one thing—

Jennia: Mhm.

Francesca Lia Block: —And if you keep just talking about it or writing about it without elevating it through craft into art, that can be great, or it can become a bit negative, or, you know, you can get lost in that. So I think that that's why I really love craft elements, plot structure, all these things that I study every day, because they can take that and lift it up and make it more relevant to others. And, in doing so, take it away from that sort of wallowing kind of state that you're talking about.

Jennia: Mhm. Do you think that finding a way to make it relevant to others is sort of the turning point where you realize that you've moved past that?

Francesca Lia Block: I do think so. I mean, I don't believe that we should start with that intention. I think it's best to think of maybe one person you love—Anne Lamott talks about this. Like, writing for someone you love—rather than thinking about all those people and Goodreads, you know, if we do that, I think we're just in trouble. Forget it. But if you write from your soul, from your love, from your truth, and then you shape it according to craft, and then you put it out into the world, I think it's going to naturally reach more people—

Jennia: Mhm.

Francesca Lia Block: —And this is why I teach the healing through writing. I teach it with two sets of questions. One set of questions has to do with craft. What is the character's gift, flaw, want, need, wound, arc, etc., etc.? And the other set of questions are: What are your personal obsessions? What was your personal childhood wound? Who was the antagonist that you had to face in order to overcome a particular "flaw," in quotes, that you have? So I think they're both important, but if you teach them together, they're especially powerful because you can not be overwhelmed by the emotional part of the healing through writing questions. But you also don't have empty craft lessons that don't have behind them that real emotional impact and feeling.

Jennia: Right. Which also takes a whole-person approach, just like the podcast.

Francesca Lia Block: Yes! (Jennia laughs) Perfect.

Jennia: I just had to—(laughs). No, but as I was thinking, I thought, right, you're looking at the whole person. You're not just looking at their output. You're looking at them and what led to that output, or what maybe was the catalyst for that output, whatever it is that's driving them, and then being able to tap into that, too, and understand them. Because I would think that's also very helpful for any feedback you provide them as well.

Francesca Lia Block: Yes, I call it this attachment theory of writing. You know, attachment theory of psychology, where we have attached to our caregivers either securely, insecurely, or avoidant as children, and our relationships later can reflect that. And you can repair it through an attachment to a therapist. And I'm no therapist, but I do like to consider the teaching process as a similar attachment where you're giving complete support and you're getting to know this person as much as you can in a deep way. And then from there working with their needs and their goals and guiding them from where they are at the time.

Jennia: Do you think that someone needs to consider themselves an author in order to find these same benefits from writing?

Francesca Lia Block: Not at all. In fact, I work with all levels, all genres, all ages, all everything. You know, I really think it's about telling the story that you want to tell. The only thing that one needs to do this, is a desire to tell a story of some kind. You may not even know what it is, but just that feeling inside you that there's something you want to express. And maybe story isn't even the right word—just something you want to express through language. Starting there, because that's not something I can create for anyone. But once they come to me with that, then I can give them the tools they need.

Jennia: Do any of your students ever report back on the noticeable benefits that they've perceived in their own lives from writing?

Francesca Lia Block: Oh, I mean, all the time. It's such—it's really beautiful. Yeah, I see so much. I see it in front of my eyes. I see it happen in a course of 10 weeks, or a few months sometimes, [depends on] who I'm working with. There's definitely some ups and downs, but there's a lot of benefits and a lot of bonding that happens not only between me and the student, but between the students in my groups. So it's been a totally positive thing for me in my life. I feel very grateful that I'm able to work in this way.

Jennia: And then are there any benefits you've seen come up more than others, just based off of your own students or even yourself?

Francesca Lia Block: I think trusting the self. You know, a lot of my students will come to me with the deep knowledge about what they need, and maybe there's some, practical things they can learn from me, but that deep knowledge of the story within them is there. It's just about validating, encouraging, just to—giving them permission or validation to be themselves. And then from there there's been—incredible progress happens.

Jennia: Well, do you have any parting advice that you would like to leave listeners with?

Francesca Lia Block: I like to say life's hard, but you don't have to do it alone. In the same way that writing can be hard, but you don't have to do it alone. I mean, there's part of it that's alone, but you can then get support at the same time. So I believe that. And kind of like my character Izzy from House of Hearts, you know, it can be a journey through a very dark and dry desert sometimes. And it can break you, which it did to her and to me—literally writing it, I broke my ankle. It broke me—

Jennia: Oh no!

Francesca Lia Block: —Yeah, really bad. Really bad fractures. It broke me financially in some ways. It broke my relationships in some ways. It was very difficult, but it ended up bringing out so much beauty and love and light to my life in the end. So I think if you can just stick with it with support when it gets difficult—which I had a lot of, fortunately—you can get through it and you can have something really wonderful in the end, whether that is a finished book or the experience of exploring that.

Jennia: Well, thank you so much! This has been such a lovely and uplifting conversation.

Francesca Lia Block: Thank you so much! It was wonderful. I really appreciate it.

Jennia: And thank you for listening, and be sure to check out the show notes for additional information. If you enjoy today's show, I'd greatly appreciate it if you shared the episode with a friend. And please join me next week when Jessica Fein will share how to write about grief in a way that builds connection. Thanks again!