351. Does Anyone Else Feel This Way? An Analyzation of Early Adulthood with Eli Rallo

Author, lifestyle expert, and creator Eli Rallo discusses her new book, Does Anyone Else Feel This Way?, the experience of imposter syndrome, and the rise of the quarter-life crisis in the latest episode of the Writing and Editing podcast.

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Discover all Eli has to offer on her website:
https://www.theelirallo.com/

Pre-order a copy of Does Anyone Else Feel This Way?:
https://www.theelirallo.com/does-anyone-else-feel-this-way

Continue following Eli's journey on her socials:
https://www.instagram.com/eli.rallo/
https://www.tiktok.com/@elirallo

Transcript

Jennia: Hello, I'm Jennia D'Lima. Welcome to Writing and Editing, the author-focused podcast that takes a whole-person approach to everything related to both writing and editing. It doesn't seem to matter how far we come as creatives when we think about imposter syndrome, since it still hits most of us, at least from time to time. Whether you're just starting out or you've released one bestseller after another, those feelings still pop up and threaten to dim our spark. The title of Eli Rallo's newest book, "Does Anyone Else Feel this Way? perfectly captures these feelings and fears and reflects the theme of today's discussion.

Jennia: Well, I'm so thrilled to have you here today!

Eli Rallo: Thank you so much for having me! I'm so excited to be here.

Jennia: So you've said in other interviews that you dreamed of being a writer since you were really young. So how have those dreams both differed and been similar to the reality?

Eli Rallo: That's a good question! I think when you have a really big dream, you might not be thinking explicitly of what it would look like in actuality. And especially with something like books, I feel like it's a little bit different because publishing is such a sort of gatekept, undercover industry. It's not as easy to kind of picture what it would be like to be a published author because you don't really know what goes on there.

Jennia: Right.

Eli Rallo: So I will say that I wanted to write books and I think I was picturing the practice more than the product. The idea of, like, writing on a deadline and having a book deal was kind of what I pictured more so than, like, actually publishing books. I will say just like anything, it is a job. And I think that something that I always, like, make sure to be super grateful for is, like, hobbies that I have that aren't monetizable. Because I think that once you start monetizing something there are different pressures and goals that, like, that passion might not have been associated with before. So, you know, before I was published, I think writing was just a release. It was something that I feel like I had to do, something I was always doing. Something that I felt so just connected to and with. And it was such a beautiful thing for me. And it still is, but it's obviously very different now that I'm sort of, like, in this, grind and working toward, like, specific set goals by my publisher and my agents and myself. So I definitely think it's different, but it's not bad (laughs).

Jennia: Right. So how do you think that hustle culture contributes to people feeling like they do need to monetize something that's a hobby?

Eli Rallo: You know, I think you have to make a conscious decision. Like, I think you have to decide, like, do I want this to become work or not? Because even though it can be your passion and even though you can love your job, like, it still is work. And I'm not trying to compare that to any other types of jobs at all. Just for me, it takes away a bit of the magic. Like, writing was really a magical thing for me, and now it's a magical thing that's also a job. You know, I have deadlines and due dates and it doesn't get to be sort of this, like, languid creative thing. It's sort of more rigid and structured. So I would say, like, you have to make that decision of, like, what things in your life are you okay with the magic kind of falling away from it a little bit, because it does become, you know, part of your reality, and part of your day to day, and part of, like, your structured life.

Jennia: So how do you maintain some of that magic so it's still there, but it's not completely eradicated, even if it's diminished?

Eli Rallo: I try to really act on impulse with writing, so if I feel called to write about something, I'll do it. And if— And whether or not that turns into something that, like, ends up being read or published for work, it's okay either way. So I try to keep the spark alive by just keeping myself creative and, like, keeping myself hot within that creativity. So even if I'm on deadline— For example, this book, I'm working on something else in tandem that just, like, speaks to me or makes me feel creatively inspired.

Jennia: If you could go back to your younger self, what would you tell her about being a creator and an author? And maybe how she could have prepared herself for that life?

Eli Rallo: Oo, that's a really good question. I would just say, like, you don't need to know everything. Like, I think it can be really overwhelming when you reach a point that you wanted to be at or in for a long time and you're facing that and it's, like, real and it's in front of your face. Like, it can feel like, okay, I have all these questions, but I shouldn't ask them because I need to act like I know what I'm doing here. And I would say there's no stupid questions. And that's, like, silly advice, for some, but I think it's just like advice worth remembering because I think my first year of doing this, I was really, like, very much on Google being like, "What is normal?" because I am afraid to ask questions— 

Jennia: Mhm.

Eli Rallo: — I was also really young and I think that youth brought this idea that I had to, like . . . I had to, like, execute everything perfectly without asking any questions. And now I'm a little bit more like, okay, I'm gonna ask those questions and I'm gonna be honest that I don't know what's going on. And also, like, really lean on and rely on your other authorial friends, your other creator friends. I feel like having people that understand exactly what you're going through— 

Jennia: Yeah.

Eli Rallo: — is such an important thing. Like, I never realized how much I would need people that, like, really get it and that are also going through it. I have a friend that I share a pub date with and it's so nice that we can just chat— Even though, like, she wrote fiction, I wrote nonfiction, different publishers, different process, everything, it's nice that we can just, like, connect and be like, okay, so we're both freaking out. Cool (both laugh). Like, it's community and that's really, really helpful.

Jennia: Yeah. And then how did you find some of these people in your community? Was that easy to do? Or did it take—I don't? want to say guesswork, but trying out maybe one friendship and then realizing maybe this person isn't in the same place you are or doesn't have the same kind of feelings and can validate what you're going through.

Eli Rallo: I would say the internet is really helpful for that. Like, I think most of my friends that I've made through, like, writing stuff have been on the internet because most people are, like, posting about their writing. So kind of, like, following along with people online and creating community with them there and then they introduce you to one person, and they introduce you to one person, and then, like, going to the book talks in your area, or the book tours, or going to meet authors. Like, you just meet like-minded readers and writers. I've also taken, like, classes before, and this was, like, before I was published. Like, when I was in college, over summer times, I took classes in New York and I think, like, that was a great way to meet people and connect with people. So that's kind of what I would recommend. Just, like, put yourself out there. Online is a great way to do it. Go to places where writers and readers would be.

Jennia: Yeah, I think that's good advice, especially going online because so many of us in this community are fairly introverted. But even just that first step into the online community is sometimes all we need. Or it's that little push because, like you said, people will then introduce you to other people or they'll invite you to an event, or some sort of thing that they're going to be doing soon, or a talk, or signing. And it just becomes this natural wave of motion into other avenues that you might not have even been aware existed before then.

Eli Rallo: Yeah, I think it's something that I'm so grateful for as somebody who's introverted. Like, I connected with some authors on Instagram and then one of them, who's more extroverted, put together, like, a group chat of, like, a ton of New York City-based authors and, like, threw me in that group chat—you know what I mean? So it's, like, things like that where it's, like, if you're putting yourself out there, somebody will see that. I do believe you have to see the good in everything and you have to believe the best instead of the worst. So I think in believing the best that, like, making these connections online, sharing their writing, kind of communing with them on the internet could turn into some kind of real valuable friendship and also real valuable community as well.

Jennia: Mhm! Well, looking back at your book, you also talk about insecurity. And so if you're comfortable, I'd like to hear what that looked like for you. And even where you think some of the insecurity came from.

Eli Rallo: I don't think anyone is just, like, born secure and happy. Like, I don't think that those are our baseline emotions. I think we, like, mistake a lot of times, like, joy and security and confidence as things, like, we should all just inherently have. But, like, I do believe all of those things, unfortunately, take work. And I think that insecurity was just, like, something I, like, came into the world with. Especially, like, growing up a young woman. I was born at, like, the tail end the 90s, so 98. So, like, kind of coming of age and, like, the 2000s and 2010. Like, we all know how women were spoken about. We all know, like, how fat everyone thought Jessica Simpson was and, like, other just beyond crazy things that were happening in tabloids and in the media. I just think, like, society, like, designed itself, especially back then, to raise really insecure, anxious young girls that are now insecure women. So I think there was a lot of work to sort of undo that. I don't think the insecurity was born of anything other than just, like, the society in which we live. And I wouldn't say that I'm, like, a secure person 24/7. I used to have this idea in my head that, like, once I was a published author— 

Jennia: Ahh.

Eli Rallo: — once people wanted to, like, work with me, I would cease to feel insecure and I would stop comparing myself. But instead, I think it's just who I'm comparing myself to is what has changed. And now I'm at this other place of, like, I'm comparing myself to people that are also authors or, like, also creators. I don't think it ever really goes away.

Jennia: Yeah. Are you okay sharing what some of those comparisons are that you're making now?

Eli Rallo: Yeah, of course! I mean, like, I, every week, watch other authors, like, get the "New York Times list or go on this talk show or go on this podcast. I watch them, like, get reviewed in this magazine or have this interview. And you start to ask yourself, like, why am I not doing those things, or should I be? I'm pretty good at handling jealousy. Like, I'm not a very jealous person. And when I do feel jealous, I'm really good about, like, understanding that internally and not projecting onto other people. But I will say that it is still— Like, every day is still a thing of, like, you just see this endless stream of people sharing their successes, and you wonder, like, why yours look different or don't look the same. And I don't think there's any, like, one real good answer to, like, any of that. But I will say that, you know, seeing other people achieve things and even in the creation space, like, content creation— Like, they're at that event, they're partnering with that brand, like, they got to do this really cool thing. I try, though, to just, like, turn my attitude sort of toward gratitude and the idea of, like, everybody is, like, fighting their own battles and everybody's going through their own things. And just because someone has something doesn't mean that I can't also have it.

Jennia: Right.

Eli Rallo: Like, the idea that somebody has something doesn't mean I'm gonna not get it. And I— 

Jennia: Yeah, that scarcity mindset. Yeah.

Eli Rallo: — Yeah! I usually try to see it as a signal of, like, okay, that person got or has that thing that I want. Like, how can I work toward it so that we can both have it instead of being like, why them and not me?

Jennia: Yeah, that seems like a good mindset shift to have. Because, again, going back, that whole scarcity mindset thing, especially with books, it’s not like someone's only going to read from one author or pick up one book that week or that month or maybe even that day. So it's not as if you've lost that opportunity. But, yeah, I think using it as motivation is probably really helpful. So— 

Eli Rallo: Yeah, 100 percent.

Jennia: — even within your community, then, do you guys talk about imposter syndrome there? Or have people shared other coping strategies that they have?

Eli Rallo: I'm not sure if I've talked about it that much, like, within my community, specifically. I definitely think I talk about it in therapy and with friends who aren't authors.

Jennia: Mhm.

Eli Rallo: I try to just be supportive of other authors and creators. Like, I know that we're all probably dealing with this. Like, I think just by nature of, like, having done it for so long, I'm now kind of of the mindset, like, we're all comparing ourselves. We're all insecure at certain times. We all have anxieties about our careers and our books and our work. The best thing we can do is support and uplift each other. Like, sometimes, like, someone just needs a little, and a little can actually mean a lot. And so I always just try to be supportive of my fellow female writers just because I know—I know what it's like! And I think, you know, pay it forward and just be a support system for other women who you know are going through the same thing.

Jennia: Yeah. Do you think it's harder for some authors than it is for others? And if so, why is that difference there?

Eli Rallo: I mean, in general, I think publishing is, like, a predominantly white industry, like so many industries. And I think that, like, we'd be remiss to not say—I'd be remiss to not say that, like, white men and white women for sure, by and large, have the easiest time in the industry. And so any complaints that we have don't hold a candle to authors of color, marginalized authors of any kind—sexual orientation, race, class, religion, etc. I try my best—and this is something that I kind of put myself to. In 2018. I read this study that this woman tried to pitch a book to a bunch of agencies and she got rejected from all of them. And then she did it under a male pseudonym and she was, like, eight times more likely— 

Jennia: Ohh.

Eli Rallo: — I don't remember the exact study, but, like, it's—what's crazy is, like, the majority of books are written by women, but if you're a man, you're more likely to have your book published. And it's a slim majority, but it is a majority. And I just imagined to myself if that's how hard that was for a white woman, like, can you imagine a nonbinary person, a nonbinary person of color, a Black woman, like, etc. So I started to only read books written by women and people of color, all different minorities, groups and marginalized communities. And I just feel like my world has opened up so much as a result. Not only do I get to champion authors who don't have the same opportunities I do, but I've learned so much. I think my empathy has grown so much. Like, I've read books about every corner of the world. Like, books set everywhere. Books by people of all different backgrounds, books by people who are immigrants, books by people— Like, just everything. And I feel like it just made me a better reader and a better writer. So definitely people have a harder time. And it's worth acknowledging, but also, like, there are things we can do. One is bring attention to it, but two is, like, actually support those writers because— 

Jennia: Right.

Eli Rallo: — it's so much harder for them. So that's something I try to do to the best of my ability. And I feel grateful that I have the privilege that I can uplift other people. So I'll try to do it as often as I can.

Jennia: Yeah, exactly. And I think that's something that is seen commonly on both Threads, as the first place that comes to mind where you do see studies like that, or maybe even just informal observations from some of those authors who are saying—or sharing their experiences. And it just becomes very, very clear that that really is the reality.

Eli Rallo: Yeah. No, and I think it's really great that people are speaking up, like on Threads. Like, we see a lot of authors having conversations about representation, and we see publishers called out. And I think all of that is really, really important. Like, we have to stand together. And I really, really do feel that it's, like,, so deeply unfair, that I want to be someone that can be uplifting other writers. Because not only do I know how difficult it is, but, like, I'm a very privileged person who knows how difficult it is.

Jennia: Mhm. Well, so somewhat related to that, what about outside judgment and how do you handle that? Or even what have some of those outside judgments been?

Eli Rallo: Yeah, I think, like, I kind of have my own boundaries set. I think a lot of authors are sort of similar with, like, reader reviews. I don't really go down those rabbit holes just because I— As a reader myself, I find reader reviews to be for other readers. Like, the idea of a reader review, like, you're not cultural critic necessarily. Like, the idea of you going on Goodreads to review a book is to tell other readers, like, hey, if you resonate with my reading taste, here's what I like and here's what I don't. Totally subjective and awesome. But the thing about reader reviews in general is that my favorite book could be my best friend's least favorite book. And that does not make the book good or bad objectively. It makes it subjectively my favorite book and her least favorite book.

Jennia: Mhm.

Eli Rallo: Art is all subjective. I don't really believe in, like, bad art unless it's, like, actively doing harm because somebody is going to resonate with it. Again, as long as it's not actively doing harm. So for me, reader reviews, I tried to, like, with my own work, distance myself from— It was a recommendation given to me by other authors who I admire. Most authors in my community who I know do the same. And then, like, in terms of, like, other feedback, I'm getting that from, like, obviously my team, my publisher, and then, like, other professional feedback they'll forward along to me so I can see as well. I don't think that that's not accepting criticism. I think that that's just a healthy boundary. Like, once my art leaves me, like, once a book is published and done, like, I'm not accepting critique on that work anymore. Like, I had so much of that. You can critique it— 

Jennia: Yes!

Eli Rallo: — for other readers. But, like, I, the author, I am not. I find it to be quite strange when people, like, tag authors in their nasty— 

Jennia: Ohh, right!

Eli Rallo: — reviews of their book. I just find it to be inappropriate. So that's kind of my boundary with that. But in terms of just, like, the peanut gallery of life, I heard Rachel Zegler once say this, and it really resonated with me because she finds herself in the midst of a lot of controversy and hate, and it's so unbased and awful. And she said that she's happy that people are just passionate about the things that she works on, even if they're, like, really mean and horrible. Like, it just— They're passionate about it. Like, they're passionate about "Snow White, and it's like, okay, like, good for you for being passionate. I can't quote her directly, but I kind of feel the same way where it's like, okay, like, if you hate everything that I do and create, that's totally fine. I'm glad you're, like, passionate enough about the world of publishing that, like, you're so passionate to hate me, I don't know. I just try to do my best and be kind to myself and other people and to work hard and put my best foot forward. And, like, I feel just so much gratitude that this is my job and career that, like, I'm very much so in the mindset of, like, you know what? If you're gonna hate, go for it. Like, I don't even know your name (laughs).

Jennia: Yeah, this is all fairly new, too, because it used to be, for the most part—especially before self-publishing—that your publicist or the publisher would be doing all the marketing for you and you wouldn't really have these direct interactions with your readers. So how do you think that social media has changed that landscape and even the accessibility to this feedback and judgment?

Eli Rallo: I think social media is a huge blessing. Right? Like, obviously everyone has their own takes on it within the publishing world. For me, like, I owe everything to social media. So I love social media. I think that, like, what I was saying about, like, tagging authors in your nasty reviews, like, that's something that we see a lot of and it's something that generally all authors, I would say, like, are united against that. Like, I don't know a single author that's like, tag me in your bad reviews of my book! (both laugh)

Jennia: No, I've never seen that either.

Eli Rallo: When you really dedicate yourself to something and it's really deeply intimate and personal and you put it out in the world, it is a lot to read, like, a super nasty thing. So I think there's that piece of that puzzle where it gives people, like, full access to you in a way. But also I think the benefits outweigh the negatives for sure. Like, it helps you to find a reader base and it brings people together in community around your books and you can also find other authors and readers. I love following authors on the internet and, like, shouting out their books and tagging them. It's like, I love to be a positive in the book world. I feel like I've connected to so many amazing authors whose books I'm, like, I don't understand how this isn't, like, the biggest book ever. Like, this book is amazing! And I love being able to do that online. So I would say the benefits outweigh the negatives, but there are negative.

Jennia: Yeah. So in your opinion, why do consumers feel comfortable criticizing creators in a way that they may not criticize others in a different profession?

Eli Rallo: Gosh, I mean, like, it's the parasocial relationship of it all. Like, I also think the pandemic has kind of created this energy of, like, everybody only understands things in relation to themselves online. Like, they feel like everything is a direct call out or attack. And I feel that they lack social skills to the point of, like, being very cruel and mean. People sometimes say like, "Oh, this is a performance review," if you're a creator getting hate. And it's like, but that's just not true because if you had a 9-to-5 job, your boss would get fired if they went in front of you during, like, lunch hour when all of you and your coworkers were, like, sitting around a common space and started berating you and calling you ugly and fat and useless and untalented. They would get fired. That's not an appropriate use of the term "performance review." I understand what you're trying to get at, but constructive criticism has to come from a place of wanting the person to do better. It cannot come from a place of hating a person. If you are claiming to be constructively criticizing someone, you need to be, in the same breath, hoping that they'll fix, alter, remedy whatever it is you're criticizing. You have to hope the best for that person. You have to hope that they would take your insight and transition it into something really productive. It's really reductive to say, "This is constructive criticism: You suck. Never write a book again." That's not constructive criticism— 

Jennia: Right.

Eli Rallo: — It doesn't come from a good place., like, that's the thing about criticism. It has to come from a good place of you wanting the person to better themselves. So I think it is disappointing because it has become really muddied. But being on the internet for five years, I find that I have a pretty good handle on it. Some days are harder than others, but it's okay.

Jennia: Well, you also touch on the quarter-life crisis. So can you explain what this is, first, for people who don't know? But also why this discussion is so necessary and so necessary right now.

Eli Rallo: I think that's a great question. Everyone's heard the midlife crisis, and it's specifically like when men go and buy cars and, like, they freak out— 

Jennia: (laughs) Right.

Eli Rallo: — They're in their midlife. I think the quarter-life crisis is somewhat of a newer phenomenon because I think that there used to be such, like, a cut and dry sort of system that people went through. It was like if you were a woman, like, maybe you would go to college, but maybe you wouldn't. And, like, you would be married by the age of, like, 22, 23, having kids immediately after. People had their place. And I think it's a beautiful thing that that's not our reality anymore. But it's also quite new. Like, our grandparents—all of our grandparents—lived in a time that they did not have the proliferation of choices, options, and journeys, paths that we do— Did not have all the freedoms that we do. Certainly we have a long way to go. And no one is saying that's a bad thing. It's an amazing thing. But it obviously creates a lot of anxiety, decision fatigue, loneliness, isolation. That wasn't a thing when everybody was doing the same thing. And now everybody's not doing the same thing because they don't have to. Which is amazing, but it creates a bit of disillusionment about adulthood, and that's kind of what I touch on in the book.

Jennia: Yeah. Well, so you've had labels and names applied to you, such as being dubbed the Gen Z Carrie Bradshaw. So has that contributed to your quarter-life crisis (Eli laughs) or how you view yourself? Or has it maybe made it easier?

Eli Rallo: I think compliments are always great—I think that's a compliment. I think compliments are always— 

Jennia: Oh that's definitely a compliment! (laughs)

Eli Rallo: I think compliments are always great. I feel really honored when people, like, tell me that I am like a big sister to them or someone they look up to. I take that with so much responsibility. Like, to me, it's a massive responsibility for someone to see me as a guiding light for them. So I think, in a way, the pressure has been good because I think it makes me really inclined to want to be my best self. But always, like, pressure like that can make you feel kind of anxious about how you view yourself as well.

Jennia: Or feeling like you have to live up to that label or that name on a constant basis, which just isn't realistic for most of us because we're going to have bad days or days we aren't functioning the way we'd like to be functioning.

Eli Rallo: Absolutely!

Jennia: Yeah, so I'd love to have you go into this just a little bit more about what you think would help someone who's going through a quarter-life crisis or even how they could identify that they're going through one.

Eli Rallo: I feel like identifying it is sort of just, like, you feel very stuck, isolated— Like, stuck in a routine. Just, like, uncertain, unmoored, untethered. And I think for the remedy, I think the book's title kind of speaks to what I pose as the remedy throughout it, which is that the hardest thing, but also the best thing you can do, is reach out and ask, does anyone else feel this way? And I found that for so long, pretending like I felt fine and not anxious, and not troubled, and not weird about life—I think weird is a good term— 

Jennia: (laughs) Yes!

Eli Rallo: — it made it a lot worse. But then when I was able to be like, hey, does anyone else feel this way? It was so much easier. Like, just to hear that I'm not the freak by myself, crying in the back of an Uber because I don't know what I want to do with my life. Like, everybody else does feel this way, or at least some people do.

Jennia: Right, yeah, I agree with that. I mean, I think that's true of almost anything we're going through. As soon as we break out of that isolation and we see that we're not alone in those feelings, it gives it a sense of maybe not normalcy, but knowing that there's understanding out there and that you don't have to face it alone and try and grapple with it all by yourself.

Eli Rallo: 100 percent.

Jennia: Well, and to end this on a more lighthearted note, what is your favorite show tune?

Eli Rallo: Oh my god! What is my favorite show tune? Gosh, like when you place—when you say the word show tune, I, like, can't give you, like, my actual favorite musical theater song because it's so, like, prolifically sad but also beautiful. So I'm gonna give you a fun one. Probably, "I Got Life from "Hair specifically the 2008 cast recording by Gavin Creel. It's just a song that reminds me of, like, living every day to the fullest. Also, like, with the knowledge that, like, Gavin is no longer with us, like, it really touches me in such a special way. I try to listen to it, like, whenever I'm feeling sad or just need a little jolt. That's, like, my favorite cast recording of all time. So everyone listen to "Hair!

Jennia: Yes! What a fun note to leave it on. And also, just for people listening, if you want to know how to incorporate a song or song lyrics, do it just like that. Share what that meant to you. That's the perfect way to do it! (Eli laughs)

Eli Rallo: Thank you!

Jennia: Yes! And thank you again!

Eli Rallo: I appreciate it!

Jennia: And thank you for listening, and be sure to check out the show notes for additional information, including all of Eli's links. And if you enjoyed today's episode, I'd appreciate if you could rate or review this podcast on Spotify or Apple. Thanks again!